5x5 matrix: Ashmax

[pego]

Hi

I already run a successful business (not loads of profit, but enough), so i am pretty business minded.
and i have several other affiliate businesses that i have recently started, but can't yet get the natural search listings they require to be successful.

However when starting my affiliate business i came across a 5x5 matrix system that supposedly automates itself after you get your first 5 down-lines. The system is ashmax. Please be aware i am not trying to promote the system with this post.

I am wondering if any one has partcipated in it and been successful? (many on youtube and various websites swear by the system, but as far as i know they could be in the grand master plan to scam people). I have joined the free system, but not yet payed the $25, as i don't have my 5 down-lines.

I would basicaly just like someone to investigate/research it and tell me if they think its a worth while thing to do as i am sceptical of the current reviews available.

Please note, that the system is legal according to the UK trading standards and the equivelant usa FDA. It is a matrix system that shares similarities to a pyrimid system, but is based on downl-line commissions from the purchase of two seperate services.

Any thoughts would be good. And any ideas on how i could get 5 people would be good too if i decide to go ahead with the system -Gumtree doesn't allow commision ads and adwords does not allow get rich quick schemes.

Thank you

[James Smith]

Sounds like a pyramid scheme to me.

Or in other words dont waste your time - the whole point of these things is to swear blind you are making millions from it (when you are not) to persuade others to pay into the pot.

Fundamentally where does the money from the payouts come from? If its from other peoples subs then its a con however its dressed up.

[pego]

If there are honest people running it (which i probably doubt), then the system would definately work, whether or not the profit is based on getting people to buy a product to gain commission and then getting them to get people in order to get commission etc....I do not see anything illegal, dishonest or unprincipled in this so long as the participents know this is what they are involving themselfs in from the outset.

The systems only fundemental flaw is that it will collapse in on its-self one day in the future (implode). But (presuming it is run honestly) based on their implementation of the system, it should def work. I have done the math and completing the 5x5 matrix in 100 days could happen/is possible, so the system as described is not flawed.

My only doubt is the honesty of what they advertise (they will fill the matrix for you within 100 days so long as you get the first 5 people in 20 days).

I have always disregarded systems like this in the past, cause they have scam written all over them, so why i think this one might work interests me.
If i could get an impartial view on it from someone who has been there and done it then that would be great.

[James Smith]

had a quick look and it screamed "S.C.A.M" in 200 foot high neon lights to me!

then again I am old and cynical.

If you put in $25 it might be a good investment to cure you of "get rich quick" scheme mentality.

[pego]

yeah you might be right - i need cured. And the investment is not that much to lose. However i havn't got my 5, so no point paying the $25. At least i'm sensible enough not to pay until i know i can get 5 (it feels impossible).

I even told people i would give them a cut of my profits if they signed-up, but no luck whatsover.

[dodds]

Ashmax does not claim to be a get rich quick system and actively discourages people from joining if they are not prepared to put in a bit of hard work. I am not surprised that many people have not made much money from affiliate marketing if they are not prepared to commit themselves fully to their business. Every business requires dedication and hard work.
I know plenty of people who have joined Ashmax and got their 5 people in far less than the 20 days and then carried on recruiting more to pass on to others who are trying their best but still require 1 or 2 to complete their 5. As was stated this business will work, the math cannot be faulted, but it will only work for those who are fully committed. The whole point of the 20 day limit is to weed out the tyre kickers.

[dodds]

As a previous contributor says he had "a quick look" at Ashmax he has immediately shown that he has not made a fair assessment of Ashmax. Of course a system which gives ordinary people the opportunity to make an initial investment of $25 and be able to generate a monthly residual income of $22,000 within 4 months is going to throw up warning signs - but please be fair, look under the hood, do the math, look at the companies you are dealing with (they have been paying out these commissions for 10 years). Not a penny is paid to join Ashmax, it is a free system which helps to get people focussed and take action instead of procrastinating.

[James Smith]

Dodds, dont be so ridiculous.

You are being conned. I appreciate you WANT to believe its true, just like when you are 6 years old and believe Father Christmas is real but do remember there will come a time when you finally figure out that its just make believe.

All the nice pictures of cheques, people standing in front of sports cars its all a big con. The only winners are the people taking your cash and no doubt doing a moonlight flit when it implodes.

Please remember is is ILLEGAL to promote pyramid schemes in the UK. That means you can get prosecuted for asking others to join. The OFT do prosecute such cases.

Regards,

[pego]

Hi James

Please be aware this is not classified as a pyrimid scheme as it is based on commissions of sales from real services/products, so ashmax is only organising your commissions and allowing team work for your matrix to be filled. It is a legal system, as the UK government cannot illegalise a system which is based on downline commisions from two servicers that are legal in their own right.

However, Dodds i recognise your tone of voice and i believe i have come across some articles where you are tirelisesly advertising the system (i might be wrong), just some of the words/phrases you used are some what similar to the sales pitches i initialy read. Good on you if you have been successful with the system.

I would like to here your story (whether your earning the $22,000/month as guaranteed by ashmax).

[James Smith]

Pego what ever they claim its a pyramid scheme/ponzi.

If there was real cash to be earned then the focus would be on earning commissions rather than on recruiting other members.

To put it anoyher way once you have recruited your 5 other mugs, then what? Does the money just magically flow into your account? Or do you actually have to do something to earn it?

There was one a couple of years back claiming that by clicking on a few adverts every day you would double your money every 14 days. It was just the same sort of set up as this. Anyone in the industry would know that commercially the click-throughs earned on 5 or 10 clicks a day would be negligible, and once the advertisers suss what was happening (people sitting clicking) they would pull their advertising in a flash. That is so say it did not stand up to even the most basic of commercial scrutiny. This didnt stop them running for a good 6-12 months before going pop (and I think they claimed they have ben in business for years, which was clearly a lie)

Question: If the scheme promoters have a fantastic high yield cash generation system, why go to all this bother recruiting people and looking like a scam? Why not simply employ a few people on minimum wage and just run the thing, and keep all the commisions themselves?

Answer: Because they dont have a fantastic high yield cash generation system. They just have a pyramid scheme.

[James Smith]

Added, 12DailyPro was the one I was thinking about above:

Some stuff on wiki about it, near the bottom:

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_Ponzi_schemes.

If you look for posts I made in 2006, you will almost certainly see similar comments to the ones above about it before it went pop.

rgds,

[pego]

the clicking on ads scheme is fraudulant because you are deceiving advertisers into paying for ads that are not being clicked on in an honest manner, so you are litterally steeling.

The ashmax system is not based on theft, but commissions from downlines. and all services associated to ashmax may be bought on this basis.

It is not classified by the UK government as a pyrimid scheme, because A. 2 seperate paid for products are involved and B. the two websites offering these services are legit and pay commissions with or without the scheme being in place.

Besides the only reason why pyrimid schemes where illegalised was because too many people where becoming too rich from them and if theres something the government hates, thats people making money too quickly (something to do with the economy crashing), as everyone who has ever participated in a pyrimid scheme knows the risks from the outset. Ponsi systems are completely different because they are based on securing a return for one person based on receiving money from another (there is no downline/matrix involved, just one level).

However i have new business ideas, so i'm shelving this one.

[James Smith]

Pego,

I do have a bit of a "thing" about pyramid schemes or ponzis (they are in essence the same thing, its splitting hairs to try and define each as separate things, I have no idea why you would think they are much different, go find out who Charles Ponzi was and why Ponzi's are so called - it was a scam through and through, using new cash to pay out old) anyway you will have to forgive my indulgence on keep on posting about this, but I dont know where you are getting your information from but you really are being fed a load of drivel there.

The clicking on ads scheme was fraudulent because its was a pyramid scheme/ponzi/call it what you like, dressed up as a advert clicking programme. Just as this one is dressed up as some commision paying website that you magically get a share of by recruiting other people to pay money to the scheme promoter..........?

It would be classed as an illegal pyramid schemes, as its an illegal pyramid scheme.

The reasons pyramid scheme are illegal is they are in essence a fraudulent activity, and the only winner is the promoter. Everyone else loses, apart from occasional some early adopters who might make some £££, but normally put it back in and lose it.

Its geat that you are doing something else but its concering that cant see through it. You seem to be convinced by some extremely flimsy arguments. I liked in particular the "people make money too quickly" one. That made me smile!

I should point out I post this stuff so others dont fall for it, not just for your benefit. It is surprising who does. I occasionally have really quite sensible clients come to me with these things and it often takes some convincing to make them understand what they have fallen for. Often they come back and tell me how stupid they have been, but usually only about 1 or 2 years later once the money has evaporated.

If it seems to good to be true - it is

Regards,

[pego]

James

I actually know a person who is living a pretty good lifestyle from a so called pyrimid system (and no they are not the top dog, but got in there before the government deemed them illegal or before he realised it was illegal).

In a previous post i said i was not sure of the honesty of the people running the system, not that i did not trust the schematics of the system, as anyone with a brain can work out that the system would work if it ran as it is described to run. So we don't need people such as yourself to advice us against them, we are more than capable (at least most of us are) to understand the risk we are taking with choosing to either trust the system operatiors or not (cause thats what it comes down to in the end), i choose not to because ive seen their mugshots.

Anyway, i'm not sure where you get your knowledge from because a Ponzi system is completely different from a pyrimid system and operated with completely different conditions and risks. Please read up on the two systems before you tell me i am under knowledged. Additionaly it is just a matter of oppinion whether a system is fraudulent or not, from my research and although the uk trading standards may one day make it illegal, i beleive the system to be as worthy of a legal status as a person who hands out business advice for money. Where is the crime in creating a matrix system with downline commissions. In fact this sort of system is more about individuals sharing their wealth as apposed to scamming each other, and yes there will always be someone at the top pocketing bucket loads, but who realy cares unless your jealous of them.

[James Smith]

Pego,

Its really sad to see you get sucked in like this. You are making a number of clearly false statements. Pyramid schemes have been illegal in the UK for years. I know I am being confrontational but you really need to get a grip on reality here.

If you wont listen to even basic things on here about what is going on (can you not even look at Charles Ponzi on wiki? He is the daddy of the pyramid scheme, so I dont really understand why you dont equate the two things as one - they are like calling a vacuum cleaner a Hoover, when in fact its a Dyson, both still clean your floor)

Please learn from the mistakes of others.

Paid to surf was the big thing in 2006.

Take a look at some threads, for example here:

http://www.singingpig.co.uk/forums/thread/23551.aspx

And here is one early one when I first came along it, see my post on the 23rd January 2006 being a "tyre kicker"

http://www.singingpig.co.uk/forums/4...howThread.aspx

And then after they all got screwed counting their losses:

http://www.singingpig.co.uk/forums/1...howThread.aspx

and this one later on:

http://www.singingpig.co.uk/forums/1...howThread.aspx

I know you will swear blind that this time its different, but its just the same old thing. Same people convinced they have found a magic way to make money. Same zeal. Same boring old accountant calling it a load of horse droppings and being laughed at...........and then of course its goes pop and everyone has lost of this money they put in.

Greed is a basic human condition and can be used to manipulate you. Just as it is now.

As in the posts here this really is a topic that I am fascinated by how someone who ordinarily is sensible and often highly intelligent suddenly chucks in all logic and chases a dream of huge amounts of cash. If you read the posts on these threads no-one really seemed to believe in it - but dared not, not believe in it, just in-case its real. It almost has parallels with religious belief and fanaticism which is perhaps why I find it so interesting.

Anyhow I know you wont appreciate it now, but hopefully I will have helped someone not get ripped off.

Regards,